DoD 87 update. My take.

runequester

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As usual ,apologies for English. Feel free to reply in Swedish or English as you prefer.

So from what I gather, there's been a lot of words written about the 2016 Drakar och Demoner. I rather like it, so this isn't a complaining thread, but a common thing I see people raise is that they were expecting and hoping it would be a more or less straight reprint of the 87 (or other) box set with a few small updates, not a new game.

So here's the point of the exercise:
What would be a "faithful" 1987 update look like, with the minimum changes to polish off rough edges?

My take:

* I would swap the D100 to D20 ala Expert. Yes, it feels like an unneeded change, but it does have tradition and its "friendlier" to new people. Also see the next step.

* I do NOT generally see "ping pong" (that high defense characters usually parry, dragging melee out) as a flaw. Bring a crossbow and shoot the fool. HOWEVER, its a common enough complaint that using a D20 allows people to use "Pendragon" rolls or "attack success is subtracted from parry chance". Therefore, include both as options in a sidebar.

* For the same reason, perfect rolls happen when rolling equal to skill and a fumble on a 20. This increases the chances from the original (1-2% to 5%) but thats more fun and dramatic anyways.

* Scale armor back at the higher ends. Mail is 4 absorption, full plate is 6.

* Maybe scale damage bonuses back a bit too.

* Make life for magic users slightly easier.

* A few skill adjustments, like Övertale getitng a base chance and some professions actually having access to it. Generally each profession can probably get another 2-3 skill picks. I might also include 3 "novice" skills when you make your character where the starting score is Base chance x 2.


That begins to sum it though. Your thoughts? Your ideas?

Again: The aim is the smallest changes to the system.
 

damogn

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* For the same reason, perfect rolls happen when rolling equal to skill and a fumble on a 20. This increases the chances from the original (1-2% to 5%) but thats more fun and dramatic anyways.

Perhaps I misunderstand this, but it seems the added chance of perfect roll is just a consequence of changing from d100 to d20. Whether you roll equal to skill or equal to 1 is irrelevant, since P(x=1) = P(x=FV) = 1/20. If you wish to change the rules as little as possible you could keep perfect = 1 and fumble = 20.
 

Leon

Leo carcion
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damogn;n348713 said:
Perhaps I misunderstand this, but it seems the added chance of perfect roll is just a consequence of changing from d100 to d20. Whether you roll equal to skill or equal to 1 is irrelevant, since P(x=1) = P(x=FV) = 1/20. If you wish to change the rules as little as possible you could keep perfect = 1 and fumble = 20.
Fast perfekt funkar på 1 inte så bra med Pendragonsslag.

Det klassiska med Pendragonsslag är ju annars att använda 1T100 och lägga perfekta slag och fummel på dubbletter. Det är så vi kör i Hjältarnas tid/Kopparhavets hjältar, och det var det jag körde i min hommage till svart lådan 84: Monster och Människor.
????
 

revault

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runequester;n348703 said:
* Maybe scale damage bonuses back a bit too.
Om jag minns rätt så krävdes det väldigt höga värden på både styrka och storlek (snitt på 17?) för att få någon skadebonus i 87:an. Jag gillade personligen skadebonusen från 91:an bättre. Dels för att det inte krävdes lika höga värden och dels för att den ökade i mindre steg.
 

runequester

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damogn;n348713 said:
* For the same reason, perfect rolls happen when rolling equal to skill and a fumble on a 20. This increases the chances from the original (1-2% to 5%) but thats more fun and dramatic anyways.

Perhaps I misunderstand this, but it seems the added chance of perfect roll is just a consequence of changing from d100 to d20. Whether you roll equal to skill or equal to 1 is irrelevant, since P(x=1) = P(x=FV) = 1/20. If you wish to change the rules as little as possible you could keep perfect = 1 and fumble = 20.
This is true, but the thinking was if people want to use Pendragon style rolls (highest under skill) then you'd get a weird situationwhere you want to roll a 1 OR as high as possible.

If you use "subtract my level of success from the parry roll" (which some skills in Expert used anyways) then Perfects on a 1 works better of course.

Det klassiska med Pendragonsslag är ju annars att använda 1T100 och lägga perfekta slag och fummel på dubbletter. Det är så vi kör i Hjältarnas tid/Kopparhavets hjältar
Also a good option. Or rolls ending in 0 or 5 as in Harn.

Om jag minns rätt så krävdes det väldigt höga värden på både styrka och storlek (snitt på 17?) för att få någon skadebonus i 87:an. Jag gillade personligen skadebonusen från 91:an bättre. Dels för att det inte krävdes lika höga värden och dels för att den ökade i mindre steg.
Yes, the table in 91 was an improvement and should be used instead for both reasons you mention.
 

damogn

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Of course! With Pendragon rolls 1 isn't a great choice for perfect rolls. Didn't think of that since you wrote it was optional, but it is certainly nice if the perfect rule doesn't conflict with the optional ones.
 

runequester

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Lupus Maximus;n348771 said:
What about having a perfect on rolling exactly the target number instead of a one?
Thats what I meant in the original post, I just typed it weird :)
 
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